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The Next Level

Author: The Bulwark

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Sarah Longwell, Tim Miller, and Jonathan V. Last bring their signature political insight and banter to the masses in The Next Level podcast. Tune in to hear them discuss the news of the week, break down campaigns and elections, and wade into pop culture feuds. www.thebulwark.com

298 Episodes
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This week Sarah and JVL did something they haven’t done for a couple of years: they just . . . hung out and asked each other questions. Some stuff about life. Some stuff about The Bulwark. Some stuff about the world. Hope you enjoy listening as much as they enjoyed visiting with each other.
The crew is back together, live in D.C. and fired up. From wild personal stories to real talk about how we face this moment as a country, this episode is all about connection, community, and not giving in to the chaos. When things get dark, we stick together.
JVL and Sarah Longwell zero in on the government shutdown chaos and what it really means. They debate why Democrats can’t afford to play defense, how Trump is openly embracing authoritarian ideas like Project 2025, and the GOP’s sheer inability to govern even as they drive the country toward crisis. 
Pete Hegseth calls in the nation’s top generals and admirals so he can lecture them about being in shape and ending wokeness and Donald Trump can speak ominously about “the war from within” and using American cities as training grounds for troops. JVL, Sarah Longwell and Tim Miller react to the supremely weird meeting—and then spend some time reflecting on how the first nine months of Trump’s second term have stacked up against JVL's worst case scenario from a year ago.
Sarah and JVL talk about big-tent liberalism—who’s in and who’s out of the l-word tent. JVL goes on a riff on Henry Kissinger, which you are absolutely going to HATE. And then we get the main event: JVL doesn’t think [gestures broadly] all this is fixable. Sarah has a plan to fix it.  Who’s right?
Tim, Sarah and JVL are back! They talk about Trump’s mob-style shakedowns of ABC and Disney, Jimmy Kimmel refusing to cave, Kamala Harris admitting "it" about Pete Buttigieg, Trump’s clownish UN meltdown, and the government’s demented social media propaganda. Head to https://ZBiotics.com/NEXTLEVEL and use the code NEXTLEVEL at checkout for 15% off. Go to https://shopremi.com/THENEXTLEVEL and use CODE THENEXTLEVEL to get up to 50% off Catch The Bulwark on September 27 in Toronto and October 8 in DC. Get your tickets at https://TheBulwark.com/EVENTS
JVL and Sarah go head-to-head over the New York Times, Trump’s $15 billion lawsuit, and what solidarity really means when democracy is on the line.
Tim, Sarah and JVL are BACK! Trump’s allies want to charge protesters with RICO, Kash Patel stonewalls, Trump plays the victim, and MAGA world spins truly nuts new conspiracy theories about Charlie Kirk’s assassination. Get 50% off your first month with Green Chef at https://GreenChef.com/50NEXTLEVEL Get 30% off your order with Soul at https://GetSoul.com and use the code THENEXTLEVEL. For our friends in Canada, we added a second live show with Sarah, Tim and Sam to the schedule. Tickets are on sale now for our bonus Bulwark Live Q&A Matinee show on Saturday, September 27, here: https://admitone.com/events/the-bulwark-podcast-toronto-10155121
Sarah and JVL talk about the president’s response to Charlie Kirk’s murder and why it’s so dangerous. Then we go deep on how to react in moments of crisis: Can you be too nice? How do you balance truth and compassion? What is the impact of timing? And was JVL right to turn the comments off for the first 24 hours? Do us a solid, though: Don’t comment on this until you’ve listened to the episode. 
Tim, Sarah and JVL are back! Trump shrugs at Russian drones, clings to a laughable “hoax” defense on Epstein, and gets played by Netanyahu yet again — while Kamala Harris calls Biden’s 2024 run reckless. To get 6 bottles of wine for $39.99, head to https://NakedWines.com/THENEXTLEVEL and use code THENEXTLEVEL for both the code AND PASSWORD. Get 15% off OneSkin with the code THENEXTLEVEL at https://www.oneskin.co/ #oneskinpod Get $35 off your first box of wild-caught, sustainable seafood—delivered right to your door. Go to: https://www.wildalaskan.com/NEXTLEVEL.
Sarah and JVL go through the Epstein Birthday Book in detail. We tell you what’s actually in it, no euphemisms. And what it means for Trump and 2026. But before you ask: It’s Tuesday. So no Rebecca.
Sarah and JVL go long on the economy, The People, double standards, RFK, and . . . Hamilton. It’s a super-sized Secret pod. In the comments, we want you to talk about whether or not the double-standard is real—is it true, as JVL proposes—that voters obsess over Democratic mistakes while waiving away Republican insanity? And if it is true, why is it? Remember: We’re not just talking about partisans, but about the generalized broader public. We want to hear your theories.
Sarah, JVL and Tim are back! Trump disappears for a weekend and sets off health rumors, Epstein victims speak out on Capitol Hill, and Congress releases “new” files that turn out to be mostly recycled documents. Meanwhile, Trump tries to change the subject with National Guard deployments, a tariff scheme runs into the courts, and GOP leaders flirt with blood-and-soil politics. Get free shipping and 365 day returns with Quince at https://Quince.com/THENEXTLEVEL Go to https://Zbiotics.com/NEXTLEVEL and use promo code NEXTLEVEL for 15% off your first order.
Another dark week: Trump toys with occupying Chicago, the FBI under Kash Patel ignores domestic terrorism, RFK Jr. runs HHS with conspiracy theories, and even the CDC is led by a political crony. JVL and Sarah Longwell ask the hard question, what if our democracy is already too broken to fix?
Sarah Longwell is back and ready to go! They dive into Trump’s accelerating authoritarian moves, from masked cops snatching people off the streets to purging the Federal Reserve, while Gavin Newsom trolls Trump with meme-style politics that energize Democrats but raise doubts about his 2028 chances. Meanwhile, the DNC looks out of touch, bogged down in land acknowledgments and bad messaging, leaving many wondering if the party is ready to stand up to Trump’s power grab.
JVL, Tim Miller, and special guest Andrew Egger get into the rise of Trump’s cult cops, the right’s open flirtation with Caesarism, and whether Newsom’s new “mean streak” is a weapon or a trap for Democrats. Head to https://greenchef.com/50NEXTLEVEL and use code 50NEXTLEVEL to get 50% off your first month, then 20% off for two months--with free shipping! Go to https://zbiotics.com/NEXTLEVEL and use NEXTLEVEL at checkout for 15% off any first time orders of ZBiotics probiotics. Get 60% off your first Smalls order PLUS free shipping when you head to https://Smalls.com/THENEXTLEVEL. Go to https://GetSoul.com and use the promo code THENEXTLEVEL for 30% off.
Sarah and JVL defend the honor of Baby Boomer protestors and debate the merits of anti-fascist sandwich throwing before hunkering down for a loooong conversation about whether Trumpism is a perversion of conservatism, or a fulfillment of it.
Sarah, Tim and JVL are BACK! Trump turns a late-night DC fight into an excuse for a full-blown National Guard takeover — complete with a TV personality running the cops. The gang tackles this absurd “Big Balls” pretext, Trump’s upcoming Alaska summit with Putin (and the Billy Joel geography lesson), his bizarre choice of an unqualified weirdo to cook the jobs numbers, and what it all means for the economy, authoritarian crackdowns, and the next elections. Plus: Sherrod Brown’s uphill Ohio battle, and why Democrats need real butch he-men running for office.
Bill Kristol fills in for JVL during this extra super secret edition of the Secret Podcast. Trump’s economy is cracking under its own weight—grocery prices, tariffs, and a sputtering job market are chipping away at his support. Could these numbers spell trouble for 2026?
Go to https://zbiotics.com/NEXTLEVEL and use NEXTLEVEL at checkout for 15% off any first time orders of ZBiotics probiotics. Tim, Sarah, and Sam talk Trump’s continuing Epstein nightmare, the GOP’s redistricting chaos in Texas, and RFK Jr.‘s disastrous anti-vax decisions. Plus, Megyn Kelly picks a fight with Sarah, Acosta creeps everyone out by interviewing an AI ghost, and conservatives suddenly think they made human breasts cool again.
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Comments (11)

sharonlove2lindy

"Read-only access is not safe... it usually, almost always, implies "copy" access as well.

Feb 6th
Reply

Mona Peterson

I’ve been thoroughly impressed with ‘The Next Level’ podcast! The insights and actionable strategies shared are both inspiring and practical. https://www.podchaser.com/podcasts/deli-wrap-solutions-5796598/episodes/how-deli-paper-is-made-218086040

Aug 2nd
Reply

Linda Marie

Question at end of "How we got here?" How did the convo go straight to Joe stepping down and wholly bypassing the strategy/possibility of expanding his current VP/successors role as a strategy? With Kamala highest likely replacement whether via the polling or structural issues, why not run THEM as a TEAM? Seems she's in the best position to "understudy" Joe in international affairs, where the other possible top ticket options seem limited in that area. Trump on global stage= terrifying

Jul 4th
Reply

JPD

Tim, I can NEVER remember the name of this pod. I listened to the New Orleans live and agree. I vote for a rebrand.

Nov 15th
Reply

DogMom

I came here looking for Tim Miller content. I can only say, RUN TIM!!! Get as far away from these old people (I, too, am old) as you can because their taint will totally degrade your brand. The lady is a petulant scold who has a very perverse notion of propriety. (Who cares what Sen. Fetterman wears?!) The dude lost me when he started making excuses for BoBo Boebert and the theater fondle. I like Tim best on the Bulwark pod with Charlie. Hope he's there more often.

Sep 23rd
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R P

So, you want me to pay to listen about more hunter Biden bs? No thank you.

Aug 11th
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Karluigi Marie

Holy hell... I would be mortified if my child supported Trump. I would be incredibly depressed wondering what I did wrong.

Jul 31st
Reply

R P

Funny how JVL had no idea his "BFF" Tim had been arrested back in the day.

Mar 23rd
Reply

Redeyz

What's the story behind the personal gym trainer who has a story somewhat akin to this tale. And are we to assume no homosexual activity took place to Falwell and Johan Carlos?

Oct 31st
Reply

Lindsey Helfrey Scott

honestly. never heard this before, this is a great show

Oct 5th
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Emmm Arrrrr

I love this pod. I so appreciate the humility you all exhibit. I'm a crazy liberal, and I feel like you're a moderating influence on me.

Sep 10th
Reply